Corona Virus, general conversation

#61
Oh one other item. There's anecdotal evidence that NSAIDS like Aleve or Ibuprofen might cause additional issues. The current guidance is to take Acetaminophen only. I'll have to find the study somewhere. But it's being said that anything by Acetaminophen (Paracetamol) could cause a slight dip in immune response, enough to wreck havoc.

And of course, don't drink alcohol with it unless you want to box your liver.

Governor Murphy of New Jersey just imposed a curfew 20:00-05:00.
What's that gonna do?
It's all the kids and people who don't take this seriously.

Imagine a crowd the size of the workforce running around hanging out with friends lonely and afraid and upset all congregating together.
 
#62
Governor Murphy of New Jersey just imposed a curfew 20:00-05:00.
What's that gonna do?
It is absolutely VITAL - to politicians - that they, the politicians are seen to be "doing something". Otherwise, come next election, the people are going to be saying: "Grandma and Grandpa DIED and - insert politicians name - didn't DO ANYTHING to save them!"

It doesn't actually have to be anything useful, just something the politician can point to during the campaign as proof that he tried and that he cared.
 

Road

Adventurist
#63
Oh one other item. There's anecdotal evidence that NSAIDS like Aleve or Ibuprofen might cause additional issues. The current guidance is to take Acetaminophen only. I'll have to find the study somewhere. But it's being said that anything by Acetaminophen (Paracetamol) could cause a slight dip in immune response, enough to wreck havoc.
.

Is that supposed to say "anything BUT Acetaminophen" ? I'll look for the study/source, too, but that should be corrected less someone be potentially misled.

Thanks for the heads up.

edit: This is all I could find in a quick search:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/covid-19-nsaids-ibuprofen/
.
 
#64
.

Is that supposed to say "anything BUT Acetaminophen" ? I'll look for the study/source, too, but that should be corrected less someone be potentially misled.

Thanks for the heads up.

edit: This is all I could find in a quick search:

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/covid-19-nsaids-ibuprofen/
.
thanks, "anything but". writing on cellphones suck. obv there are going to be other medications that doctors can prescribe, but some steroidal and NSAIDS such as ibuprofen and naproxen are gonna be bad.
 

smlobx

Adventurist
#65
My daughter contacted me last night, the Peace Corp is evacuating all Peace Corp Volunteers from Namibia. She didn‘t know for the rest of the continent. One would assume that if they are pulling 185 PCV’s out of Namibia they will evacuate the continent.
‘That’s interesting given the fact that Namibia is the least populated country on the planet. Plus the last time I checked there were no cases there. I actually mentioned to a fellow traveler that we needed to go back there...
I hope everything turns out Ok for her.
 
#67
heh.. reminds me of once when I was younger and suffering from allergies pretty bad I had the idea that if I got drunk enough they wouldn't bother me.. it was also a really bad idea...
 
#68
I just got an email from my dentist that, in accordance with the CDC recommendations that patients avoid routine and elective dental work until further notice, they are closing their office and cancelling all appointments for the time being. They provided a phone number to call for instructions in case of a dental emergency.
 
#69
heh.. reminds me of once when I was younger and suffering from allergies pretty bad I had the idea that if I got drunk enough they wouldn't bother me.. it was also a really bad idea...
I used to go to Chico State, former PlayBoy #1 ranked party school. One of my floormates in our dorm used to get sloshed on 2 tylenols and two coors LIGHTS. And he's big 250lbers. yeah his liver was toast by the time he was 18. Doctor said anymore drinking and he'd probably die before he was 25. The guys in the dorm still tried to force him to drink.
 
#71
Oh yea.. I used to think heaven was a Percocet a flexeril and a 6 pack of buds... it would get you completely smashed.. I mean it says right on the bottle that alcohol intensifies the affect... it's like hell yea!
 
#73
‘That’s interesting given the fact that Namibia is the least populated country on the planet. Plus the last time I checked there were no cases there. I actually mentioned to a fellow traveler that we needed to go back there...
I hope everything turns out Ok for her.


Apparently it’s world wide, thanks she is a bit stressed.
 

Road

Adventurist
#75
With St. Patrick's day celebration looming... I'd say, probably save lives.
.

City of Portland, Maine put into place a mandatory city-wide curfew from 0600 today 'til 0200 tomorrow to prevent St Patty's Day public gatherings of any type.

ALL restaurants, pubs, and gathering spots ordered to close the entire day today and from 2000 to 0200 each night the rest of the week. $500 fine to anyone violating the prohibition. Bangor, Maine has done something similar.

Grocery runs, dog-walking, etc allowed.

Portlanders, other than the night crowd in the Old Port and local pubs, had already self-isolated to a large degree. I was the only guest at breakfast early yesterday at the very popular Miss Portland Diner. I had a feeling I would be, so felt safe to go:

MPD_0194-900.jpg

Feel bad for the owner there; he has hundreds of pounds of corned beef for today's St Patty's Day meals and much of it will go to waste. I suggested he donate it to the food shelters and homeless centers and send out a press release.

Lots of local places like bagel shops gave away anything perishable before closing for a couple weeks, business has been so miserable.

Interesting times.

.
 

Dave

Adventurist
Founder
Senior Staff
Editor
#76
It's important that everyone remain rational during these times. Fear and panic will make it all much worse.

Most of you know about my day job, I'm sharing some info here from .gov and "what I know" with my friends and family here. I will continue to update this with anything of note from official, unclassified sources:

COVID-19 CHART.png

Coronaviruses are a family of viruses that can cause a wide range of diseases in humans. Coronaviruses are often the cause of the common cold – giving people annoying but largely harmless symptoms such as runny noses and a mild cough. Other times they may cause significant harm to people such as was seen with the Middle Eastern Respiratory Syndrome (MERS, or MERS-CoV) or the Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS, or SARS-CoV), and now with COVID-19 (technically classified as SARS-CoV2). The reason for this wide variation in how the virus affects humans has to do with how much the virus has changed over time. Often only small changes occur that allow the virus to infect people but result in only mild symptoms. Other times, such as with SARS, MERS and COVID-19, the changes that occur in the virus are large or in areas that the human immune system isn’t prepared for or isn’t equipped to defend against and this causes severe disease. Similarly, these changes also make it difficult to develop diagnostic tests and vaccines that are unique to the virus.

Latest COV-10 Developments as of 16 Mar 2020:

Worldwide 153,517 cases (+10,982), 5,732 (+343) deaths (WHO SITREP 55)

US 1,678 cases, 41 deaths

Laboratories approved to test for COVID-19 no longer need CDC confirmatory test.

CDC recommends for the next 8-weeks, organizations should cancel or postpone in-person events that involve 50 or more people.

HHS has complete initial worldwide modeling for the spread of the disease, making assumptions consistent with limited experience with the virus:

- At the current rate, the doubling time of cases will be 6.5 days

- 60% of population will eventually be infected

- 50% of those infected will be symptomatic (i.e. 30% of population)

- Of the symptomatic cases 3% will be hospitalized (higher for older age group)

- Of the symptomatic cases 0.25% will die (higher for older age group)
 

Dave

Adventurist
Founder
Senior Staff
Editor
#77
COMMON SENSE ACTIONS YOU CAN TAKE NOW:

As part of standard infection control practices, routine cleaning should be rigorous and ongoing, and time should be allocated for individuals to routinely clean. Surfaces touched most frequently should be prioritized for routine cleaning because these surfaces can be reservoirs for germs and an exposure pathway for transmission to people through contact with these surfaces. Watchstanders should conduct cleaning of high contact surfaces, at a minimum, with each shift change.
Examples of priority areas for routine cleaning include:

• High contact surfaces that are touched by many different people, such as light switches, handrails, doorknobs/handles, workstations, keyboards, telephones and countertops.
• Dust- and wet-mopping or auto-scrubbing floors.
• Vacuuming of entryways and high traffic areas.
• Removing trash.
• Cleaning restrooms.
• Wiping heat and air conditioner vents.
• Spot cleaning walls.

Note: Identify and routinely clean and disinfect high-risk locations even before a confirmed case of COVID-19 occurs (Example: Restrooms, Dining Areas [Clean and disinfect tables, counter and chairs frequently])

Cleaning removes germs, dirt and impurities from surfaces or objects. Disinfecting kills germs on surfaces or objects.

STEP 1: Cleaning: Always clean surfaces prior to use of disinfectants in order to reduce soil and remove germs. Dirt and other materials on surfaces can reduce the effectiveness of disinfectants. Clean surfaces using water and soap or detergent to reduce soil and remove germs.

STEP 2: Disinfection: Diluted household bleach solutions, alcohol solutions with at least 60% alcohol, and most common EPA-registered household disinfectants should be effective. Follow manufacturer’s instructions for application and proper ventilation.

Step 3: Disposal: Place all used gloves and other disposable items in a bag that can be tied closed before disposing of them with other waste. Wash hands with soap and water for at least 20 seconds immediately after removing gloves.
 
#78
STEP 2: Disinfection: Diluted household bleach solutions, alcohol solutions with at least 60% alcohol, and most common EPA-registered household disinfectants should be effective. Follow manufacturer’s instructions for application and proper ventilation.
I noticed that you didn't mention iodine.

I've seen at least one post somewhere claiming that with alcohol and bleach, as soon as the surface dries, it's immediately susceptible to reinfection, but with iodine, it will keep disinfecting for a while afterwards.

Myself, I don't know enough about it to have an opinion.

I did a Google search on iodine wound spray and discovered it's sold for veterinary use for skin and umbilical disinfection, and treating wounds, minor cuts, bruises, abrasions and teat sores. So I guess it would be safe for us to use on our hands. Just not sure if there would be any advantage to using it over alcohol. Tractor Supply sells it, as well as, I guess, other animal supply places.

Anyone know anything about it?
 

Dave

Adventurist
Founder
Senior Staff
Editor
#79
I noticed that you didn't mention iodine.
Correction: The Surgeon General did not mention it.

The standard of care for surgical skin preps is the use of povidone-iodine.

Betadine vs Iodine.:

Both of them contain iodine and is the ‘active’ ingredient, used topically to prevent infection. In terms of what is in them, betadine is a complex between povidone and I2 and can be used as a powder or solution. It contains about 10% I2. Iodine tincture contains I2 in water and potassium iodide (KI) or sodium iodide (NaI). I2 is not very water soluble but with KI (or NaI), it forms potassium triiodide (KI3) (sodium triiodide (NaI3)), which is very soluble. In water, KI3 (NaI3) is in equilibrium with KI (NaI) and I2. So when applied, the I2 gets consumed but then KI3 (NaI3) dissociates to KI (NaI) and I2 and this continues until all of the I2 is consumed. Nonetheless, Iodine tincture contains ~5% iodine. So, the differences are the concentration of iodine, the co-ingredients, and that betadine can also be used as a powder.

A tincture, by definition, contains alcohol. So, iodine tincture contains iodine (I2), potassium iodide (KI), water and alcohol (usually ethanol or EtOH).

To be a little more specific, the USP Tincture of Iodine is defined in the U.S. National Formulary (NF) as containing in each 100 mL, 1.8 to 2.2 grams of elemental iodine, and 2.1 to 2.6 grams of sodium iodide. Alcohol is 50 ml and the balance is purified water. This "2% free iodine" solution provides about one mg of free iodine per drop.

So tincture of iodine is about 50% alcohol. And it does kill germs.

CAVEAT: We were always trained to NOT use betadine for anyone with a shellfish allergy.
 

Haggis

Adventurist
Senior Staff
Founding Member
#80
It's important that everyone remain rational during these times. Fear and panic will make it all much worse.

Most of you know about my day job, I'm sharing some info here from .gov and "what I know" with my friends and family here. I will continue to update this with anything of note from official, unclassified sources:

View attachment 50848

Coronaviruses are a family of viruses that can cause a wide range of diseases in humans. Coronaviruses are often the cause of the common cold – giving people annoying but largely harmless symptoms such as runny noses and a mild cough. Other times they may cause significant harm to people such as was seen with the Middle Eastern Respiratory Syndrome (MERS, or MERS-CoV) or the Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome (SARS, or SARS-CoV), and now with COVID-19 (technically classified as SARS-CoV2). The reason for this wide variation in how the virus affects humans has to do with how much the virus has changed over time. Often only small changes occur that allow the virus to infect people but result in only mild symptoms. Other times, such as with SARS, MERS and COVID-19, the changes that occur in the virus are large or in areas that the human immune system isn’t prepared for or isn’t equipped to defend against and this causes severe disease. Similarly, these changes also make it difficult to develop diagnostic tests and vaccines that are unique to the virus.

Latest COV-10 Developments as of 16 Mar 2020:

Worldwide 153,517 cases (+10,982), 5,732 (+343) deaths (WHO SITREP 55)

US 1,678 cases, 41 deaths

Laboratories approved to test for COVID-19 no longer need CDC confirmatory test.

CDC recommends for the next 8-weeks, organizations should cancel or postpone in-person events that involve 50 or more people.

HHS has complete initial worldwide modeling for the spread of the disease, making assumptions consistent with limited experience with the virus:

- At the current rate, the doubling time of cases will be 6.5 days

- 60% of population will eventually be infected

- 50% of those infected will be symptomatic (i.e. 30% of population)

- Of the symptomatic cases 3% will be hospitalized (higher for older age group)

- Of the symptomatic cases 0.25% will die (higher for older age group)
So figuring a population of 327 Million in the US...

60% will be infected = 196,000,000 people.

50% of those will be Symptomatic = 98 mil.

3% of those will be hospitalized = 2.94 mil

0.25% of those will die = 7,350 deaths in the US. So a death rate of 0.0025% amongst the US population.

According to this model. Another model I had cited to me by a relative whose part of the Biomedical Engineering Department at Stanford University was quoting Millions of deaths in the US. When I questioned the algorithms and data inputs as to how they arrived at that number I was told they were scientific professionals.

I don’t know who to believe so I’ll just be careful who I come into contact with, take extra caution with cleanliness and shake my head at the madness.
 
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