Overland East - Mud Mud and More Mud

I haven't seen anyone actually at the site complain.

I have no sympathy for the visitors, and don't think will be wanting it anyway, but I hope the landowner was prepared. This was predominantly bicycle oriented venue.

I'm seeing some traffic on FB about it from folks who bailed and from a few who have been turned away at the gates (with paid admissions) because the venue can't handle them coming in.
 
I saw a vendor post on ig, that they waited 2hrs for the shuttle and was still an over an hour from getting a ride and decided to go elsewhere.
 
I'm seeing some traffic on FB about it from folks who bailed and from a few who have been turned away at the gates (with paid admissions) because the venue can't handle them coming in.
For sure. I should clarify, not seeing complaints about the mud itself, but how organizers are handling it. Unfortunately long shuttle waits were an issue last year too and the skys were clear. I feel for the volunteers that are likely catching hell.
 
^^^^There will always be a whipping boy (girl, person, it, whatever). Sadly it is often the volunteer that is standing in front of you, who has ZERO control over the situation, and is only doing what they are being told to do.

Sadly, the generation of WHINERS when things don't go their way is penetrating the sport/hobby that (I'd like to think) most of us look forward to overcoming.

There was a time when I was a very active volunteer for a number of venues/events/get together's...these days I prefer being the tail gunner/sweeper at the back of the line, I eat a little more dust time to time (the name of our race team is DUST JUNKIES racing), but all of the drama is over by the time I get there. Anyone I catch on the side of the trail with an issue is more than happy to see me (usually), less complaints when I am their last hope!

I got into the overland travel/rock crawling game at the tail end of the first parade when most events were still grass roots and everybody either knew each other or knew of each other. There were some heated rivalries but for the most part we were all looking out for each other and we could adapt our plans to compensate for things that were out of ANYONE'S control.

I was at a California Rock Crawlers Association event at the Wooden Nickel Ranch back in the day, when the skies opened up and dumped on us in SoCal...that event will always be memorable because we had challenges to over come, and we made the most of the situation. All of us probably incurred some losses that day, but the promoter, who happens to be a member here, had losses with numbers that had comma's in them.

Paging @Jeff Knoll, you must know someone, somewhere that has pics of that event.:cool:
 
From what I can glean from social and other outlets is that most of the people there are having a good time.. the trouble is all the people who came and could not get in. Not allowed to camp.. then go find camping/hotel or whatever and come back to stand in line all day to never make the event. That seems to be the big issue.
 
From what I can glean from social and other outlets is that most of the people there are having a good time.. the trouble is all the people who came and could not get in. Not allowed to camp.. then go find camping/hotel or whatever and come back to stand in line all day to never make the event. That seems to be the big issue.

That is exactly what happened to us. We drove about 9 hours on Friday arriving about an hour before they closed for the night. We would have been sooner but all the rain and accidents delayed our arrival. Upon arrival the volunteers tried to find us a spot but it was just too big of a mess. It wasn’t their fault.

The problem was there was no backup plan (from them or me) I just assumed because I prepaid that I had a spot. I was told to drive a couple miles down the road to get better cell signal and to look for a camp ground or hotel.

First campground said they had been filled for months ( not surprising). I found one hotel about 45 min away that was almost 300 for the night so I passed on that one and ended up driving the Greenville in South Carolina which was and hour and 15 min away.

The volunteers said they would be refunding the camping portion but had no idea what they were going to do. One volunteer thanked me saying I was the first person that didn’t blow up at them for being turned away.

Because I “lost” my camping spot, I was now a “day pass” ticket holder and was told I had to park off site an shuttle it in. They were just overwhelmed. Only a few buses. It took hours, no joke.

They handed out free drink tickets to encourage people to go back in instead of waiting in line. They handed out free coffee to some in line to help with the cold. And if you were just a Saturday day pass holder they were offering you a free pass to come back on Sunday.

We ended up not going back on Sunday. We ended up getting a hotel that night North of the Venue that was almost 2 hours away. Just not worth all the driving, especially because I was towing our trailer because we were supposed to be camping :)

It was pretty poorly organized. The venue is too small for the amount of people in attendance. I am sure for the people who were able to make it in early it was great. But for the lucky few of us that didn’t, it was pretty unpleasant experience.
 
We were turned away also. Camping in NC can be difficult since most close on 1 Nov. W found a place over agm hour away and didn't return. I understand they can't control the weather. We didn't give any one a hard time but did wait over an hour before being turned away. One volunteer did an excellent job of briefing us about 20 minutes into our wait, made the other 40 minutes bearable because he was upfront with what was happening. I told him I really appreciated him doing that.
 
Gee I'm kind of glad we couldn't make it this year after seeing that mess. I'm out $325 but that's the way it goes. Our friends got in on Thursday in their Roadtrek van and left late Sunday and needed a tractor to help them with just the last little bit. They said the attendees were taking it all in stride. Since we missed East we have decided to go to West 2019. Really looking forward to it.

Mike
 
I see an American Adventurist tshirt in the making... "I survived Expo 2018" :)

We need a 2015 one too. #underwaterexpo

There seems to be a direct correlation between venues with the word "Ranch" in their name and mud. :facepalm

-----

Anyway, I'm not one to armchair quarterback the logistical nightmare an event of this magnitude is, however this having been my 6th expo (4 easts and 2 wests) I wholeheartedly agree the event needs to move to an established fairgrounds capable of handing not just the volume of people but also give people the ability to spread out while camping. One reason places like Taylor and Reeb Ranch, and the Mormon Dry Lakebed, turn to shit-shows is a simple question of density: cram too many people and vehicles into a small venue without any infrastructure and the high traffic areas turn to soup. This event needs to happen at a venue with established roads as a way to mitigate environmental damage. I mean, how does it look from a Tread Lightly and Leave No Trace perspective when a group of outdoor enthusiasts trash a farm (*again*)? Those should be guiding principles for events like Expo and we should leave a venue better than we found it. If that means swallowing pride and admitting the show needs to move to a proper venue then so be it. That said, I don't think it needs to become an indoor show like SEMA. Just need somewhere designed to handle the scope and magnitude of what expo has become.
 
We need a 2015 one too. #underwaterexpo

There seems to be a direct correlation between venues with the word "Ranch" in their name and mud. :facepalm

-----

Anyway, I'm not one to armchair quarterback the logistical nightmare an event of this magnitude is, however this having been my 6th expo (4 easts and 2 wests) I wholeheartedly agree the event needs to move to an established fairgrounds capable of handing not just the volume of people but also give people the ability to spread out while camping. One reason places like Taylor and Reeb Ranch, and the Mormon Dry Lakebed, turn to shit-shows is a simple question of density: cram too many people and vehicles into a small venue without any infrastructure and the high traffic areas turn to soup. This event needs to happen at a venue with established roads as a way to mitigate environmental damage. I mean, how does it look from a Tread Lightly and Leave No Trace perspective when a group of outdoor enthusiasts trash a farm (*again*)? Those should be guiding principles for events like Expo and we should leave a venue better than we found it. If that means swallowing pride and admitting the show needs to move to a proper venue then so be it. That said, I don't think it needs to become an indoor show like SEMA. Just need somewhere designed to handle the scope and magnitude of what expo has become.

I think your on the right track. A field is great when its guaranteed to be dry..... Even then dust can be an issue (much less on one maybe?). Expo is huge, it needs to be treated as such.

I wonder what clauses were in the farm/ranch owners contract. That is a lot of soup to deal with.
 
I think your on the right track. A field is great when its guaranteed to be dry..... Even then dust can be an issue (much less on one maybe?). Expo is huge, it needs to be treated as such.

As mentioned in the other thread... Oak Ridge Estate in Virginia used to be the home of Camp Jeep. HUGE event that rivals expo. Venue would be prefect.
 
I didn't hear a lot of complaining out in the camping area where we were set up. There was a great deal of discussion and armchair quarterbacking going on, but the consensus was that the volunteers were doing a difficult job as well as anybody could. They did seem a little uncoordinated. There was a lot of confusion and changing plans as they tried to adapt, but no more than you would expect given the conditions. Better communication would have helped a lot. The rumor mill was running full speed filling the information vacuum. At one point on Friday I heard people saying not to leave the camping area for the driving classes because Hanson had decreed that anyone who left would not be allowed back in. Pure rumor mill, but that's what happens when good information is not getting out.

There were a lot of people who were obviously unprepared for the weather, as well as a few who's idea of preparing an overland vehicle did not include muddin down rows of tents in an off-camber cow pasture. But even the unprepared were generally good-natured about it. We saw a lot of cold wet people and shiny max trax reluctantly plopping into the cow-patty-infused mud. Lots of folks in their brawny 4wd's sliding around and getting stuck in front of an audience of generally well meaning hecklers.

The worst situation I saw was a pretty innocuous looking spot in the camping area where the track got just off camber enough to slide every single vehicle that went through on Friday and Saturday into somebody's Oz-Tent. The spot didn't look bad at all, and despite lots of warnings, people kept trying. I could have paid for the trip with a max-trax rental stand right there.

I felt sorry for the vendors though. It's not a big deal for a recreational camper to grin and bear it when you get a little rain at camp, but it's a little more painful for a vendor who has invested a lot of time and money, and driven across the country for a trade show.

We spent every morning and afternoon taking classes in the driving area, so I don't have a good feel for what the crowds were like in the exhibitor area, but the conditions had to really take a bite out of the foot traffic. Last year it was a pleasant stroll from the camping area to the vendor area. This year it was a real effort to slog your way up there and even worse trying to move around once you were there. Perfectly doable, but you had to want something up there to leave camp and make the trek. The Cheerwine BBQ and hockey-puck sized tater-tots in one of the food trucks was a big motivator.

The driving classes suffered quite a bit. The instructors were doing the best they could with what they had, but the conditions were just too poor to allow the originally intended driving format. A lot of the classes became lectures or static demos until things started to dry out on Saturday afternoon. If they had tried to introduce random tourist vehicles into that quagmire, all of the classes would have quickly devolved into recovery demos.

Some of the classes would have worked better if there had been a few more demo vehicles available. I was in a marshaling class where the instructors were demoing by driving imaginary cars. Two of the three instructors had flown in, and the third had already loaned his vehicle to demo in another class.
 
Inspirational-Hiking-Quote-No-Such-Thing-As-Bad-Weather.png
 
Back
Top Bottom