Tacoma and Tundra to share platform

Dave

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Two trucks for the price of (developing) one...

The next-generation Toyota Tacoma and Tundra pickups will ride on the same, new platform the company is calling F1. They could see production as early as 2021. This move follows Toyota’s previous of building almost everything on its newish TNGA architecture including the Prius, Corolla, C-HR, Camry, Rav4 and more. Obviously, this saves them a boatload of money on development.

The Tundra is currently built at the company’s plant near San Antonio. The Tacoma is also built there, as well as its pair of plants in Mexico.

Auto News notes that Toyota’s pickups are the current elder statesmen in the pickup world. The Tundra dates back to 2007 with updates introduced in 2014. The Tacoma is from 2015 with updates coming next year. Tundra sales are down through the first three months of 2019, but Tacoma sales are way up, making March the 17th consecutive month of year-over-year gains.

The important question, Stephanie Brinley, senior automotive analyst for IHS Markit, posits to AN is “can you make the Tundra as big as it needs to be, while keeping the Tacoma as small as it needs to be?”

"Toyota is never going to see Detroit 3 volumes out of Tundra," Brinley said. "They don't need to beat them; they just need to build something that makes customers happy while meeting internal volume expectations and profitability targets Toyota wants."

The new platform will allow for electrification as well, which is now coming for America’s most popular models. Expect both 48-volt systems like the Ram, as well as other mild hybridization.

"We're looking at what makes the most sense,” said Mike Sweers to AN, lead engineer for the Tundra, Tacoma, 4Runner midsize SUV and Sequoia, “not only for 2025 but for out to 2035 and beyond, and what is the market demand for it.”

SOURCE



:coffee
 
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It will be interesting to see Toyota's response Gladiator, AEV Bison, etc..
 
What does "platform" mean? Same frame? Same engine? Will they use the same windshield wiper blades? I need more info. My 13' Tundra has 385hp. Can I get that in a single cab taco:looney? Didn't Chrysler do this with K-cars in the 80s. I remember them sucking
 
Nissan has been doing this with relative success for years with the F-Alpha platform. You can add that Mercedes truck we've recently discussed to the rather long list of vehicles that use it: Link

I think it will be a good financial decision for Toyota and accomplish what they want, but I would like to see a true full-size "big-3" truck competitor from them. I doubt that can be done without a specially designed chassis and their full effort. What it could possibly allow though, is some compatibility in conversions. The Titan swapped front diff on the Xterra for a mid-travel setup comes to mind. Maybe in the future a Tundra V8 could be a near bolt-up affair on a Tacoma with the same DNA... who knows?
 
Nissan has been doing this with relative success for years with the F-Alpha platform. You can add that Mercedes truck we've recently discussed to the rather long list of vehicles that use it: Link

I think it will be a good financial decision for Toyota and accomplish what they want, but I would like to see a true full-size "big-3" truck competitor from them. I doubt that can be done without a specially designed chassis and their full effort. What it could possibly allow though, is some compatibility in conversions. The Titan swapped front diff on the Xterra for a mid-travel setup comes to mind. Maybe in the future a Tundra V8 could be a near bolt-up affair on a Tacoma with the same DNA... who knows?

Subaru does this as well. The Crosstrek is the same platform as the Imprezza, and Forester and Outback are all the same engine/trans (except for the 3.6 upgrade for the Outback). Different sheetmetal over the same running gear has been a thing for a minute now across many brands.

But I think it's tough, very tough, to have a "full size" pickup share the same frame etc with a mid-size. Compromises abound, either it's going to be a pretty HD (heavy) frame for a midsize (which I'm WAY cool with) or you end up with a lighter duty frame etc on a full size.

Time will tell, but those 3rd Gen Tacomas may go way up in value if the bean counters stray too far from Toyota's legendary over-engineered reliability.
 
I think it will be a good financial decision for Toyota and accomplish what they want, but I would like to see a true full-size "big-3" truck competitor from them.

I don't think we'll ever see that but If they were to try to compete it might come from Hino and be re-branded
 
Nissan has been doing this with relative success for years with the F-Alpha platform. You can add that Mercedes truck we've recently discussed to the rather long list of vehicles that use it: Link

I think it will be a good financial decision for Toyota and accomplish what they want, but I would like to see a true full-size "big-3" truck competitor from them. I doubt that can be done without a specially designed chassis and their full effort. What it could possibly allow though, is some compatibility in conversions. The Titan swapped front diff on the Xterra for a mid-travel setup comes to mind. Maybe in the future a Tundra V8 could be a near bolt-up affair on a Tacoma with the same DNA... who knows?


This exactly was my thoughts! Heavy duty Taco would be great!
 
The Tacoma First gen was 1995.5 through 2004. Second gen came out in 2005, with the Third gen in 2015.

I beg to differ. While it's named a complete overhaul and in standard vernacular called a 3rd generation Tacoma, it's only that in name.

It's called a 3rd gen, but in reality, the actual cab remains practically identical. there are small sheet metal changes where the new doors fit, but in reality the old doors fit if you trim the corners.

The frame is practically identical as well to the second generation. All the suspension between the two tacomas are interchangeable.

#caseinpoint

1555468304781.png


The OAL (overall length) is longer but only because the front facade is way bigger. Radiator mount point is actually the same on both 2nd and 3rd gen Tacomas, As are the ladder frame and sub frame braces.
--
The "3rd gen tacoma" is actually a 2nd gen tacoma with an updated interior with 2011 technology, updated front fenders, front bumper, grill, doors and bed sides, and a new engine. The chassis, suspension, rear axle, brakes, and fuel tank.

I'm not 100% sure, but if I remember correctly, the transfercase is the same unit. Of course, the engine, gear ratios, spider and ring gear, are different.
--

Basically it's like how they said the 3rd gen Tundra traces its roots back to 2007. Same thing here.
 
I beg to differ. While it's named a complete overhaul and in standard vernacular called a 3rd generation Tacoma, it's only that in name.

It's called a 3rd gen, but in reality, the actual cab remains practically identical. there are small sheet metal changes where the new doors fit, but in reality the old doors fit if you trim the corners.

The frame is practically identical as well to the second generation. All the suspension between the two tacomas are interchangeable.

#caseinpoint

View attachment 44790

The OAL (overall length) is longer but only because the front facade is way bigger. Radiator mount point is actually the same on both 2nd and 3rd gen Tacomas, As are the ladder frame and sub frame braces.
--
The "3rd gen tacoma" is actually a 2nd gen tacoma with an updated interior with 2011 technology, updated front fenders, front bumper, grill, doors and bed sides, and a new engine. The chassis, suspension, rear axle, brakes, and fuel tank.

I'm not 100% sure, but if I remember correctly, the transfercase is the same unit. Of course, the engine, gear ratios, spider and ring gear, are different.
--

Basically it's like how they said the 3rd gen Tundra traces its roots back to 2007. Same thing here.

That's a fairly long list of changes. How much does Toyota have to change to qualify as a new generation?

And isn't it just semantics? Like arguing if a FJ Cruiser is a real Land Cruiser?
 
Car models, model years, updates, generation changes are all such a mish mash any more that the lines are blurry rather than distinct in my opinion. Take the "all new" Ranger...new to who?
 
That's a fairly long list of changes. How much does Toyota have to change to qualify as a new generation?

And isn't it just semantics? Like arguing if a FJ Cruiser is a real Land Cruiser?

The GX470 had a fairly large list of changes within its model years. Same thing for the Tundra.

In terms of Japanese vehicle design, process, and manufacturing, they have this concept of:

  • Zen-Ki (前期 Zenki)
  • Chuu-ki (中期 Chūki)
    *and*
  • Kou-ki (後期 Kōki)

Only platform changes would consist of a completely new model year and thus be a brand new model, but major changes that do not affect the unibody/frame would not constitute a model year change.

In the 1st generation Tacoma, from 1995 - 2004, there were 3 "refreshes", 1995-1997 前期, 1998-2000中期 , 2001-2004後期, this included changes to the cabs, headlights, bumpers, grill, bedsides(re: stepside), fenders, tail lights, ignition system, but no chassis/frame, engine or drivetrain changes. For the following model year, there were powerplant, drivetrain, chassis, and cab change to the 2005 model year.

The 1st gen Tundra manufactured from 1999-2006 also had a series of relatively major changes in terms of power-plant and body styling, but it wasn't classified as a 2nd generation.

My point being is that the frame and cab is from 2005, and while they say it's all new, it really isn't. In a lot of ways, Toyota USA and Toyota Motor Corp Japan is in many ways different and completely separate entities. It was a marketing decision to split up the vehicles offerings between Lexus and Toyota and likewise a marketing decision to not sell vehicles we would've wanted in the United States.
  • 70-Series LC
  • Toyota Prado (instead of a Lexus GX, and with seven powerplant options 3diesel/4gas)
  • Toyota Hilux with a fully boxed frame
They're gonna post marketing fluff to make me think that the 2016 MY Tacoma is all new, but I can throw a set of tired (yet rebuilt) Icons and All-Pro leaf pack from someone's 2005 taco onto a 2020 Tacoma and it'll drop in perfectly. I can also swap a 2005's interiors and exteriors to a new 2020 taco and vice versa w/o too much difficulty.

I wouldn't be able to say that between a 1st gen taco and a 2nd gen taco.

That's my litmus.
 
The GX470 had a fairly large list of changes within its model years. Same thing for the Tundra.

In terms of Japanese vehicle design, process, and manufacturing, they have this concept of:

  • Zen-Ki (前期 Zenki)
  • Chuu-ki (中期 Chūki)
    *and*
  • Kou-ki (後期 Kōki)

Only platform changes would consist of a completely new model year and thus be a brand new model, but major changes that do not affect the unibody/frame would not constitute a model year change.

In the 1st generation Tacoma, from 1995 - 2004, there were 3 "refreshes", 1995-1997 前期, 1998-2000中期 , 2001-2004後期, this included changes to the cabs, headlights, bumpers, grill, bedsides(re: stepside), fenders, tail lights, ignition system, but no chassis/frame, engine or drivetrain changes. For the following model year, there were powerplant, drivetrain, chassis, and cab change to the 2005 model year.

The 1st gen Tundra manufactured from 1999-2006 also had a series of relatively major changes in terms of power-plant and body styling, but it wasn't classified as a 2nd generation.

My point being is that the frame and cab is from 2005, and while they say it's all new, it really isn't. In a lot of ways, Toyota USA and Toyota Motor Corp Japan is in many ways different and completely separate entities. It was a marketing decision to split up the vehicles offerings between Lexus and Toyota and likewise a marketing decision to not sell vehicles we would've wanted in the United States.
  • 70-Series LC
  • Toyota Prado (instead of a Lexus GX, and with seven powerplant options 3diesel/4gas)
  • Toyota Hilux with a fully boxed frame
They're gonna post marketing fluff to make me think that the 2016 MY Tacoma is all new, but I can throw a set of tired (yet rebuilt) Icons and All-Pro leaf pack from someone's 2005 taco onto a 2020 Tacoma and it'll drop in perfectly. I can also swap a 2005's interiors and exteriors to a new 2020 taco and vice versa w/o too much difficulty.

I wouldn't be able to say that between a 1st gen taco and a 2nd gen taco.

That's my litmus.

The lower rear control arms and panard that I took off my 2014 FJ are going on a 2004 GX470. My Icon rear springs from the same FJ went on a 2006 4 Runner. @Chris Griggers put heavy ARB Dakar Hi-Lux leaf packs on his 2013 Tacoma. The upper control arms off my 2018 Tacoma were given to a friend with a 2008 FJ. Because the Total Chaos UCAs, PN 96504, that fit my Tacoma also fit 2nd gen Tacoma, the 2007+ FJ Cruiser, 2003+ 4 Runner, GX460, GX470, 2005 - 2015 Hilux, Prado 150 & 120 series.

Your point about the cab? Maybe. Suspension parts? Nope. They reuse suspension components everywhere.
 
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